We can't ask for the show to return to its roots.

Okay, so I was just giving this some thought. Often when people hate on the newer episodes It's because of Nostalgia. Most of these people can't help but look back and long for the old personality and genius storytelling that some may say has dwindled post-movie. Think about it this way, if SpongeBob never had the first 3 or 4 seasons, we'd have nothing to compare everything after to. There's obviously no arguing with the fact that the first 3 seasons were the Golden Ages of the show and that is where the majority of memorable moments come from. However, the way SpongeBob has altered since then is completely normal and cannot be simply blamed on Hillenburg's decision to not be as involved or the new writers. Most of the changes up to now have been natural, if you really think about it, and asking for the show to return to its roots is like asking a grown dog to become a puppy again - it's something that will forever live in our most treasured memories but cannot be experienced in the same way again. I'm not trying at all to say there's anything wrong with newer episodes, or that the show will never gain some of its old traits, in fact, I've enjoyed every episode to date and the new movie looks hilarious. All I'm trying to say is that we have to look forward and accept the changes, and with Hillenburg's return to the show( :yahoo:) , who knows? Maybe the show will regain some of its original personality. (I also forgot to mention that at least one of the original writers, Sherm Cohen, is in on the production of the new movie for anyone who didn't know.)

Also, just to be clear, I agree 100% with everyone saying that the return of a single person (Hillenburg) won't make a huge difference. I only meant that at least with him over-seeing the show and the movie more closely, he may be able to add back some of the abandoned personality. Also, it's always possible that his return will inspire some of the original writers to consider returning :).

I'll end there, in fear of turning this into an essay :P.
FOR THE LAZY, here's a SUMMARY: SpongeBob has changed over the years, we can't expect the show to go completely back in time, we can only hope for the future with the new writers and Hillenburg's return.

Why do people act like Hillenburg is what made the show good? Yes, he was apart of it, but the actual people who made the show at it's best were the writer's. People like C.H. Greenblatt, Merriweather Williams, Aaron Springer, you name it... EVEN PAUL TIBBITT.

Also, did Hillenburg even do anything for Sponge Out of Water? Cause he sure as heck doesn't act like it.

President Squidward said:

Also, did Hillenburg even do anything for Sponge Out of Water? Cause he sure as heck doesn't act like it.

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What do you mean? He hardly ever does interviews and is rarely in the public eye, where is he supposed to act like it? In the Biff Tannen interview he did, he said he came up with the idea with Paul and we've seen behind the scenes pics with him.

President Squidward said:

Why do people act like Hillenburg is what made the show good? Yes, he was apart of it, but the actual people who made the show at it's best were the writer's. People like C.H. Greenblatt, Merriweather Williams, Aaron Springer, you name it... EVEN PAUL TIBBITT.

Also, did Hillenburg even do anything for Sponge Out of Water? Cause he sure as heck doesn't act like it.

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I think it's probably because things started to change after he left, which isn't accurate because he left at the same time as many of the writers. But yeah, I agree, even Hillenburg himself admitted the writers were a huge part of what made the show what it is. That's why I'm equally as excited that some of the original writers are returning for the movie. The only one I can confirm at the moment is Sherm Cohen.

President Squidward said:

Also, did Hillenburg even do anything for Sponge Out of Water? Cause he sure as heck doesn't act like it.

What do you mean? He hardly ever does interviews and is rarely in the public eye, where is he supposed to act like it? In the Biff Tannen interview he did, he said he came up with the idea with Paul and we've seen behind the scenes pics with him.

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He's definitely quiet when it comes to his work, especially compared to others. That's why we never really know what he's working on. I can assure you, however, he's heavily involved with the Upcoming movie. He's said it in some of the few interviews he's done.

Wumbo said:

Okay, so I was just giving this some thought. Often when people hate on the newer episodes It's because of Nostalgia. Most of these people can't help but look back and long for the old personality and genius storytelling that some may say has dwindled post-movie. Think about it this way, if SpongeBob never had the first 3 or 4 seasons, we'd have nothing to compare everything after to. There's obviously no arguing with the fact that the first 3 seasons were the Golden Ages of the show and that is where the majority of memorable moments come from. However, the way SpongeBob has altered since then is completely normal and cannot be simply blamed on Hillenburg's decision to not be as involved or the new writers. Most of the changes up to now have been natural, if you really think about it, and asking for the show to return to its roots is like asking a grown dog to become a puppy again - it's something that will forever live in our most treasured memories but cannot be experienced in the same way again. I'm not trying at all to say there's anything wrong with newer episodes, or that the show will never gain some of its old traits, in fact, I've enjoyed every episode to date and the new movie looks hilarious. All I'm trying to say is that we have to look forward and accept the changes, and with Hillenburg's return to the show( :yahoo:) , who knows? Maybe the show will regain some of its original personality.

I'll end there, in fear of turning this into an essay :P.
FOR THE LAZY, here's a SUMMARY: SpongeBob has changed over the years, we can't expect the show to go completely back in time, we can hope for the show's future with the return of Hillenburg.

I guess this isn't really a question so I'm not sure If it'll get any replies, but I just had to get it out of my head :P.

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it looks like you took a page out of my book because when it comes to spongebob that is where i drop the line because there are some good post movie 1 episodes like house fancy and one course meal and i hope we get some more torture squidward episode during the post movie 2 era.

todd phillips said:

it looks like you took a page out of my book because when it comes to spongebob that is where i drop the line because there are some good post movie 1 episodes like house fancy and one course meal and i hope we get some more torture squidward episode during the post movie 2 era.

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My feelings exactly! I only wish more people would have an open mind and give the newer episodes a chance.

Wumbo said:

Okay, so I was just giving this some thought. Often when people hate on the newer episodes It's because of Nostalgia. Most of these people can't help but look back and long for the old personality and genius storytelling that some may say has dwindled post-movie. Think about it this way, if SpongeBob never had the first 3 or 4 seasons, we'd have nothing to compare everything after to. There's obviously no arguing with the fact that the first 3 seasons were the Golden Ages of the show and that is where the majority of memorable moments come from. However, the way SpongeBob has altered since then is completely normal and cannot be simply blamed on Hillenburg's decision to not be as involved or the new writers. Most of the changes up to now have been natural, if you really think about it, and asking for the show to return to its roots is like asking a grown dog to become a puppy again - it's something that will forever live in our most treasured memories but cannot be experienced in the same way again. I'm not trying at all to say there's anything wrong with newer episodes, or that the show will never gain some of its old traits, in fact, I've enjoyed every episode to date and the new movie looks hilarious. All I'm trying to say is that we have to look forward and accept the changes, and with Hillenburg's return to the show( :yahoo:) , who knows? Maybe the show will regain some of its original personality. (I also forgot to mention that at least one of the original writers, Sherm Cohen, is in on the production of the new movie for anyone who didn't know.)

I'll end there, in fear of turning this into an essay :P.
FOR THE LAZY, here's a SUMMARY: SpongeBob has changed over the years, we can't expect the show to go completely back in time, we can hope for the show's future with the return of Hillenburg.

I guess this isn't really a question so I'm not sure If it'll get any replies, but I just had to get it out of my head :P.

Click to expand...

President Squidward said:

Why do people act like Hillenburg is what made the show good? Yes, he was apart of it, but the actual people who made the show at it's best were the writer's. People like C.H. Greenblatt, Merriweather Williams, Aaron Springer, you name it... EVEN PAUL TIBBITT.

Also, did Hillenburg even do anything for Sponge Out of Water? Cause he sure as heck doesn't act like it.

Click to expand...

todd phillips said:

it looks like you took a page out of my book because when it comes to spongebob that is where i drop the line because there are some good post movie 1 episodes like house fancy and one course meal and i hope we get some more torture squidward episode during the post movie 2 era.

Click to expand...

You guys said everything I want to said guys :P

My opinion is that, people should drop that stupid nostalgia and start accepting the future. All these nostalgiatards should realize how no matter how much they complain, we would never return to the 90's and the early 00's. They may hate the newer episodes, but the new generation of kids like them.

The show can't "return to its roots" so to speak because most of the original writers were either A) promoted to directing/non-writing roles within the show, or B) left the show altogether.

Erik Wiese, Carl Greenblatt, Jay Lender, Sam Henderson, Derek Drymon, Mark O'Hare, Nick Jennings, Sherm Cohen, Aaron Springer, Andrew Overtoom...

those are some of the people who made the show what it was in the first three seasons. Gradually they went to other positions.

It isn't really the fault of the new writers. The show lost its original crew and the creator left. We've seen that happen with Ren & Stimpy and Dexter's Laboratory, both really good cartoons. A show just isn't the same without its creator and original crew.

The only way the show would become sincerely awesome again would be the return of many of the key original writers.

Oh- and the reason we never really hear about Stephen Hillenburg is because he's very, very shy. He doesn't do a lot of interviews for this reason. He apparently stays away from social media websites and interviews and mostly keeps to himself. It's not because he doesn't "do" anything. And apparently, since his departure from the show, he's been working on a personal animated short film which he plans to screen at animation festivals. And he's been directly involved with the publishing of the Spongebob comics, (which are awesome, by the way.)

Wumbo said:

I think it's probably because things started to change after he left, which isn't accurate because he left at the same time as many of the writers. But yeah, I agree, even Hillenburg himself admitted the writers were a huge part of what made the show what it is. That's why I'm equally as excited that some of the original writers are returning for the movie. The only one I can confirm at the moment is Sherm Cohen.

He's definitely quiet when it comes to his work, especially compared to others. That's why we never really know what he's working on. I can assure you, however, he's heavily involved with the Upcoming movie. He's said it in some of the few interviews he's done.

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Yeah. I heard that he's really shy and that's why he stays away from interviews.

President Squidward said:

Why do people act like Hillenburg is what made the show good? Yes, he was apart of it, but the actual people who made the show at it's best were the writer's. People like C.H. Greenblatt, Merriweather Williams, Aaron Springer, you name it... EVEN PAUL TIBBITT.

Also, did Hillenburg even do anything for Sponge Out of Water? Cause he sure as heck doesn't act like it.

Click to expand...

I totally agree with you. It wasn't just Hillenburg. It was great storyboard artists like Sherm Cohen and Erik Wiese.

I'm sorry but anyone who expects one person returning--nontheless, after 10 years--to completely revolutionize the show to old times is going to be in for a rude awakening. No paragraphs there.

There are too many people that think television animation can be done with one guy. -_-

Wumbo said:

However, the way SpongeBob has altered since then is completely normal and cannot be simply blamed on Hillenburg's decision to not be as involved or the new writers. Most of the changes up to now have been natural, if you really think about it, and asking for the show to return to its roots is like asking a grown dog to become a puppy again - it's something that will forever live in our most treasured memories but cannot be experienced in the same way again

Click to expand...

Yes, the changes that SpongeBob has had for the last 10 years have been normal for long-running show. Especially a show that underwent a massive revamp in it's writing team. However, if those changes are affecting the quality of the show in a bad way, then there is no reason why people can't complain.

Asking for the show to return to its roots is like asking Windows 8 to become XP again. We understand that the XP experience is something from the past and that we would gladly accept that the changes in Windows 8 are completely justified. However, given how awful Windows 8 is, and all of it's changes and new components and how brilliant XP is, it's incredibly hard to embrace those changes.

Yes, nostalgia goggles are a part of reasons why people hate the new SpongeBob. The show's style had been altered. From the extrinsic parts, like the animation. To the intrinsic parts, like the story-telling and the humour. And although difference is a stupid reason people use to hate something, it is pretty common.

However, most "new SpongeBob hater" critics are questioning the quality, not the changes. And as consumers, they have the privilege to criticise in any way they like. Which is, in most cases, comparing the (preferred) old with the new. And to be honest, they're not exactly wrong with that method. To me, one of the most accurate ways to judge a show's quality is by comparing it to the most similar show possible. Similar in writing style, general point in story telling, animation, etc. Therefore, it's easier to set benchmarks to rate each qualities of each show.

The fact is, SpongeBob set its own benchmark, went above and beyond in front of a mass audience, and then failing to even barely grapple the past heights for the last 10 years. While the same mass audience is still watching.

I'm saying this not to defend post-movie haters with nostalgia goggles. I want you to understand that they're not stuck in nostalgia land for nostalgia sake. But because old SpongeBob in nostalgia land is just a better show, full stop. And people, generally, like good shows more than bad shows. When you're looking at something under a massive shadow, you can't help but to look at what's behind the shadow.

To accept the changes is something people have done. To embrace them is something they haven't and they have good reasons for that. And with every passing change failing to get embraced, people will start lowering expectations. The lower the expectations, the harder it'll get to look into the future with optimism.

I agree with most people here. I don't really seperate pre and post movie. Just like MrEnter, i seperate Spongebob with "Good Spongebob" (good episodes from pre/post movie) and "Bad Spongebob" (bad episodes from pre/post movie). It is possible for a show to return to its "roots" even without the original team, for example the season 4 Spongebob episode "Skill Crane" (one of my personal favorite Spongebob episodes in history) felt in my honest opinion like a pre movie episode (the writing, animation, jokes, charm etc). I think it's amazing that Stephen Hillenburg is returning for season 10 (probably a mix with some old and new writers). The show can return to its roots even without the original team (like i pointed above), but even if it doesn't return to its "golden era" the show can be still awesome, and it can start a new era with new (fresh) episodes. Sorry for my bad English :P

Edit: I don't hate Paul Tibbitt, and i don't blame him for everything (he wrote many awesome pre movie episodes for the people who don't know :P). In my honest opinion Stephen is just a better director than Paul (i prefer Paul as writer, and he's one of my personal favorite writers on the show).

Face it guys. SpongeBob is purely just another corporate cash cow for the network to mass produce in a sausage factory style way. The execs don't give a flying rat's ::dolphin noise:: about quality control at all and I get the feeling that not even the people who work on the show particularly enjoy working on the show much at all and just want to forget about the whole experience and produce their own content, which I think would have been the much smarter move for Nickelodeon to take rather than prolonging a show way past its shelf life to the point where people have these discussions frequently. They've done the same thing with their other hit Nicktoons too unfortunately.

The younger talent are out creating their own content and really shaking up the animation industry while Viacom continues to be extremely conservative compared to other companies in the same business. I think anyone expecting future episodes to be exactly like the ones back in the late 90s or early 2000s is expecting way too much at this point.

We all know Hillenbug's leave had little to do with it. A lot of it had to do with Nickelodeon asking for more episodes and seasons and using them up far too much until the people working couldn't handle the pressure.

Popeye Q. Krabs said:

Face it guys. SpongeBob is purely just another corporate cash cow for the network to mass produce in a sausage factory style way. The execs don't give a flying rat's ::dolphin noise:: about quality control at all and I get the feeling that not even the people who work on the show particularly enjoy working on the show much at all and just want to forget about the whole experience and produce their own content, which I think would have been the much smarter move for Nickelodeon to take rather than prolonging a show way past its shelf life to the point where people have these discussions frequently. They've done the same thing with their other hit Nicktoons too unfortunately.

The younger talent are out creating their own content and really shaking up the animation industry while Viacom continues to be extremely conservative compared to other companies in the same business. I think anyone expecting future episodes to be exactly like the ones back in the late 90s or early 2000s is expecting way too much at this point.

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The people working on the show are awesome and love it. ;)

MasiHosseini said:

I agree with most people here. I don't really seperate pre and post movie. Just like MrEnter, i seperate Spongebob with "Good Spongebob" (good episodes from pre/post movie) and "Bad Spongebob" (bad episodes from pre/post movie). It is possible for a show to return to its "roots" even without the original team, for example the season 4 Spongebob episode "Skill Crane" (one of my personal favorite Spongebob episodes in history) felt in my honest opinion like a pre movie episode (the writing, animation, jokes, charm etc). I think it's amazing that Stephen Hillenburg is returning for season 10 (probably a mix with some old and new writers). The show can return to its roots even without the original team (like i pointed above), but even if it doesn't return to its "golden era" the show can be still awesome, and it can start a new era with new (fresh) episodes. Sorry for my bad English :P

Edit: I don't hate Paul Tibbitt, and i don't blame him for everything (he wrote many awesome pre movie episodes for the people who don't know :P). In my honest opinion Stephen is just a better director than Paul (i prefer Paul as writer, and he's one of my personal favorite writers on the show).

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That's a great way to put it! I agree that it's completely possible for a whole new team of writers to unexpectedly sweep in and give the show a whole new atmosphere, and I believe slowly the atmosphere is altering. :) Like you said, the show doesn't have to be exactly the way it was in the golden era, in fact, it may be nice to see some unique new episodes.

More_Spongebob_Sandy said:

We all know Hillenbug's leave had little to do with it. A lot of it had to do with Nickelodeon asking for more episodes and seasons and using them up far too much until the people working couldn't handle the pressure.

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Yep, that's it, unfortunately. Hillenburg originally wanted to end the series after or soon after the movie, in fear of it becoming over-bearing. It was only when Nickelodeon refused to take the show off the air due to its monumental success that he, alongside many other writers, made the decision to move on to other projects.

I haven't read every post in this thread yet, but what I found appealing about the show's "roots" was a consistently funny, sweet, and smart cartoon that never had to dumb itself down or resort to overwrought mean-spirited humor or overdone gross-out to get a laugh.

I don't think it's unreasonable to ask the show to just return to a consistent quality again.

Also of note: Hillenburg will have some effect on the show when he comes back. It might not be positive, but look at the output of Aaron Springer under Hillenburg and under Tibbitt and there's a big difference. It'll show again this time.

Jibbix said:

I haven't read every post in this thread yet, but what I found appealing about the show's "roots" was a consistently funny, sweet, and smart cartoon that never had to dumb itself down or resort to overwrought mean-spirited humor or overdone gross-out to get a laugh.

I don't think it's unreasonable to ask the show to just return to a consistent quality again.

Also of note: Hillenburg will have some effect on the show when he comes back. It might not be positive, but look at the output of Aaron Springer under Hillenburg and under Tibbitt and there's a big difference. It'll show again this time.

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Exactly, what really made the show special, like you said, was its original humor that relied on nothing but extremely well written jokes and hilarious visuals. And yeah, with Hillenburg at the very least giving input and ideas, there's sure to be a noticable change.

Guys, i'm kinda confused again (silly me :P). Is season 10 gonna have 2 showrunners? (Stephen and Paul). That would be awesome

I can't speak for everyone, of course, so I'm not going to - I, er, never do, actually. Anyone who knows me, knows that I pretty much don't care what everyone else thinks. ;)

I'm just glad that SB episodes and another movie are being made still... that the series hasn't been cancelled yet and is instead making new episodes and going on strong.

Steve Hillenburg proposed a series to Nick, it was picked up and almost literally *BAM* it became a super hit, Nick's mascot show! I'll bet Mr. Hillenburg never expected THAT!
It seems to have swept not only America over, but the world - at least, most of the other countries it's aired in, it seems to have done pretty well. Germany, for example, seems to have really gotten into it, making their own albums/songs, merchandise, etc.. It's enjoyed, well, extreme success.

When looking up episode lists by season, I find that I have episodes from each season that I really like and episodes I really don't like; and it seems like it's about the same amount for each season, give or take a few, far as I can tell.

I dunno.